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TKR One Year Out

@sistersinhim I hear what you are saying, and I know we often do that. But I don't think that is the problem.
But next time I try to bend, I will focus on that and see if I can't "let it go" further. Thanks for the suggestion!
 
I have a weird suggestion to build on the excellent advice from @sistersinhim ... I often focus on relaxing when moving. So... Instead of "working at" flexion by making the hamstrings contract, what happens if you... deep breathe...
focus on really relaxing your quads, all the way from hip (groin crease) to knee, and while gently supporting your leg with your hands...
"let the knee bend."

It might be a good time to resume very slow gentle heel slides. Very respectful of how it feels and, again, keeping quads relaxed.
 
Very interesting discussion regarding ROM and the three month ‘window of opportunity’. I wish there was more and better research on this as well. I am a voracious researcher and like to be as informed as possible. From what I could find, many surgeons and PT’s insist on this window, but there is very little at all as far as actual studies that prove it. Sometimes it seems like, even in the medical community, there is the tendency to just keep repeating ‘accepted wisdom’ even if there is little in the way of solid evidence for it.

I also read and was told by my surgeon that most people are ‘back to normal’ by about 3 months after a PKR. That certainly wasn’t the case for me (not even close!) and I have yet to talk to or hear about or read about any real person who has had my surgery who recovered that quickly. My PT tells me she has personally never seen anyone recover that quickly either. It would make me feel better to see actual research on that as well. Why are they telling us this if is not scientifically accurate? If it is, I want to see the research! I haven’t been able to find it.

Personally, I was unable to make much progress on my ROM in that three month ‘window’ because of my extreme swelling. If I tried to push my ROM, my already swollen knee would swell to the point it literally felt it would burst. The more I did, the worse it got. It simply wasn’t an option for me. Once my swelling went down I could finally start improving my ROM. I have gained around 20-30 degrees since 6 months post op. Would I have liked to gain it quicker? Absolutely! But my knee wasn’t having it. And I did gain it, though they told me I wouldn’t.

All that to say (sorry, I can get wordy!), I do want to see more and better research on this topic! If you find anything good, please share with the forum. Thanks for posting!
 
@JusticeRider I have a question for you, and everyone else who has their experience to share...

When you were able to start working on your ROM, where, in and around your knee did you feel the pull, and/or tightness? And how did you progress through it?

Before I stopped my flexion stretches due to the tendonitis, the only place that hurt was the side of the knee where the IT band ends. Now that that is not so much an issue, I am feeling a strong pull in the area just above my knee. A very strong pull. And that so happens to be the area that Nurse Director Josephine describes as where adhesions tend to form - see the link from Sat. about MUA and Adhesions.
But it is also the area of the quad that hasn't been used or stretched for some time.

I'm trying to determine what is causing this pull/tightness, to help me decide how to proceed.
 
The pull at the top is really common from my reading here.
It's also where I have had several palpable tough or ropy areas after my R TKA. My ortho team encouraged massage and reassured me with movement, time, and massage they would go away. At six months I very occasionally am bothered in that area and continue to do deep massage as needed, not even once daily.
I still have intermittent aches in my lower ITB and adjacent quad. In my mind all these things are one quads issue but I could be wrong.
I would recommend frictional massage both lengthwise and crosswise that mobilizes skin and the layers below it.
 
The pull at the top is really common from my reading here.
It's also where I have had several palpable tough or ropy areas after my R TKA. My ortho team encouraged massage and reassured me with movement, time, and massage they would go away.
Just wondered, at 3 months, how much pain and inflammation were you getting all around the kneecap? My understanding is that tightness is normal but pain should be gradually decreasing (mine isn’t and gets worse with a very minimal amount of activity and interrupts sleep regularly). I feel this same quads tendon area tension and am doing lots of massage, foam rolling, etc. and need to frequently stretch it by putting my foot behind me on a chair, holding a chair or counter in front and then gradually try to bend my knee (all passive keeping hamstrings and quads relaxed). With the hip straighter it targets the quads tendon area better than something like a heel slide. (Posting here as I think it’s probably relevant for OP)
 
@dotski
Looking back at my mid September posts...
the localized anterior swelling around the kneecap was quite pronounced (and remained so up until just recently starting to recede).

Acute pain only while getting into the drivers seat to drive (it's the R knee in question). Otherwise tightness, a very annoying deep ache especially later in the day for which I took low dose acetaminophen with codeine, and the ropy bumpy stuff was getting massaged very deeply at probably twice daily.

I have done foam rolling of specific trigger points in the quads as needed for about 30 years. Personally would hesitate to too actively or too often do it if I felt the quads were compromised and still need healing. I see foam rolling as a more athletic maneuver for overworked quads but maybe that's just my experience.
 
Hello marmarmish!
I hope you're having a good week so far. It's easy to forget which day of the week it is with holidays.
However, I do know it's the three month anniversary of your TKR. Happy Three Month Anniversary!
Wishing you complete healing and many blessings in the New Year!
@marmarmish
 
@Layla Thank you Layla for your kind message. And now the holidays are over, just like that! Hope yours were filled with warmth and happiness. :happy-new-year-smiley-emoticon-4:

I have some good news to share. My lasts posts came from a place of anxiety and frustration. I wanted so bad to keep up with my stretching, but the more I tried, the more the IT band pain on the outside of my knee increased. It got to the point I just had to stop entirely and let it heal! When I first started up again, my ROM was pathetic! Hence the frustration and anxiety.

I decided to try another physical therapist, and wow, what a difference!! She listened to what was going on, and really focused on my form. (I had been focused on pointing my toes straight up while doing my exercises, but she said it's the knee that needs to be pointing straight up - the foot then leans outward a bit, which is a more natural position. Changing this took a bunch of the strain off my IT band where it terminates by the knee. Also making sure my knee and hip are aligned, which puts your knees about 8" apart while doing the seated exercises.)
So, with this new info, I have been proceeding more successfully, and in just a couple weeks, my ROM is now 2 degrees extension and 105 flexion!

I saw the PA yesterday and learned something revelatory! For me anyway! And I suspect for many others as well. We often hear about this "3 mos. window" to get our ROM, before the dreaded scar tissue has formed. There has been a lot of anxiety around this, certainly with me! If you don't get acceptable ROM, then MUA is the next step! :groan:
This forum has always said, don't worry, ROM will come, and to ignore the 3 mos. myth. I needed more of an explanation to reconcile these seemingly opposing views. And I finally got that after talking to the PA!

This is what has finally been made clear to me; It is in the first 3 months where the greatest gains in ROM are made. You could possibly get a 5 degree increase in 1 week - a big jump! But after 3 mos., these big gains don't tend to happen, instead, gains are on smaller scale. You will still get your ROM, but now it will just take longer.
So, if someone got to 120 degree flexion in 10 weeks, it may take someone else to get there in 10 months.
Gains in ROM does NOT stop after 3 mos.! Maybe all this has been clear for many of you, but it just didn't gel for me until now. (And with the anxiety expressed from so many folks, I suspect I wasn't alone.)

The MUA is needed for people who's ROM is debilitating in that they cannot function well, such as walking. It's used to get them to at least 90 degrees, and it's done within 3 mos. while the tissues are still pliable. In my mind there is still a lot of controversy around MUAs, and you can read a lot about that in the National Library of Medicine website.

So, 105 degrees isn't fantastic, but I can go about my day pretty well. Just knowing ROM will get better over time is something I can easily live with. But here is where it got even more interesting! Apparently, my doctor likes to see a final ROM of about 110 degrees. That sounds a little low for me, but I'll reaccess once I get there.
What they don't want to see, is extreme ROM! Bending the knee too much puts a lot of stress on the artificial joint - the force of the metal on the plastic can damage or break it. They had a patient that was trying to get her heels to touch her butt, and this freaked them out!!

Anyway... I really hope this post in particular helps to clarify your questions and put you at ease! :thumb:

@Layla or other BoneSmart staff, can you please change my thread's title to "ROM still comes after 3 months".
Thank you.
 
You are welcome and Thank You for your sweet sentiment! I changed your thread title as requested.

What a wonderful update. I am so happy for you that you're feeling less anxious, found a good match in a new PT and have clarity on the topic of MUA, hopefully this puts your mind at ease and you will embrace allowing yourself more time to heal, which does take patience, but you're doing it!! :thumb: Thanks for the update. Please continue to share your progress with us so we can cheer you on along the way!
Have a lovely weekend!
@marmarmish
 
Thank you so much for sharing all of this detail in your thread, @marmarmish! You have a great PA -- someone who really listened to your concerns and helped ease them. And your new PT sounds like a gem!
Your optimism is infectious! :flwrysmile:
 
Just wanted to post a little update. Still going to PT and have worked with 2 therapists. Both have been fabulous! They really seem invested and watch my form constantly - such a big change from the previous place I went. Tho that therapist was really nice, in retrospect, he was too laid back; felt like he was just going thru the motions.

Anyway, the soft tissue issues I have been struggling with are getting better, but not completely gone. My therapist has done some painful, but productive deep tissue massage along the IT band, and down the muscles running alongside the shin. And I was dressed up with KT tape, which to my surprise, really helped!

I still have aches and pains, they come and go. It seems like I get over one pain, to have another pop up elsewhere. Sometimes I walk very comfortably, and sometimes getting up I'm pretty sore and stiff. And, sometimes I seem more swollen, not sure why. Not too stressed about it tho, I've come to accept it's just the nature of this recovery. (Thanks to all the previous posters.)

My ROM has improved. I got to 110 flex, and 0 extension with help from the therapist. 105 flex and 1-2 extension on my own. I know it's been said not to let the therapist push your ROM, but I am no worse for wear afterwards, and so think the stretch is helpful. Further, they don't push more than I can handle.

As has also been said in this forum, improvements are often hard to notice because they happen so gradually. But I sometimes realize I'm doing something I couldn't do before, for example, walking on grass! Ha! In FL, we have a very thick grass, and for a while I couldn't walk on it. When I first started to, I did it because it forced me to lift my knee higher than walking on the sidewalk. For a while it was uncomfortable. But I noticed last week that I walked across it without a thought. Oh it's the small things!! :egypdance:

I hope everyone is happy and healing. And for those of you early in this journey, I wish you all the best! :friends:
 
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I know it's been said not to let the therapist push your ROM, but I am no worse for wear afterwards, and so think the stretch is helpful... they don't push more than I can handle.
What we mean is don't let the therapist push you into pain.

It's okay for you to have a little assist with bending -- as long as you are in control of how much (since only you know how it feels) and as long as he/she doesn't hurt you. If they are listening to you when you say "enough", that's fine.

Glad to read that you are doing so well. And, yes, your range of motion will continue to improve with motion and with time.
 
What an encouraging update. I am finding little things that I can do now that I couldn't before. I am not going to physio anymore. Unfortunately, a limited amount is covered here. The one physiotherapist I would love to have, and would be a great help, I cannot afford.
 
A great update!!!! Thank you.
 
Quick update. It's been about 4 1/2 months now since surgery, and I am progressing nicely. My last flexion measurement was 114, extension of -2. I've taken longer walks, did a full hour this week and that was a bit too much. I was stiff and sore the next day, so I'll cut that down to about 45 min. at a time.
I am able to go down the stairs now, tho I still am cautious while I do it. Physio wants me only once a week now, and I have only a few more sessions to go anyway. I am definitely getting stronger and walking pretty normally. To be clear, I am still achey. Up until recently I still woke up in the middle of the night with an ache in my knee that was quite bothersome. That seems to have died down. Getting up after I've been sitting for a while causes a groan, but a bit of moving the knee, and all is okay. I still hurt, and I am constantly aware of the discomfort and ache, but it is getting better.

I still clearly remember those first few months, and for those of you who are still struggling 3+ more months after your surgery, I really feel for you! I feel lucky my recovery timeline hasn't been as long as some of you have, and I hope you get to a good place in time. :friends:
 
It sounds like you're having a really good recovery - those aches and pains, and the stiffness with sitting slowly improve.
 
This is great to hear….congratulations! Your post will give hope to many of our members who are still in the “challenging” phase of their recovery.
 
Sheesh, I didn't realize it's been so long since my last post. I didn't have much more to add, the worst was over and it was just a matter of continued recovery. It has always been my plan to update after one year, and well, the end of September is one year since surgery! So this is where I'm at...

I am walking pretty good, as in with a normal gait. Recently I went all day, walking all over the city I was visiting - covering 18,000 steps! Yes, I got a bit sore, but walking really is no issue. What is still bothersome, is sitting for while (especially after being up on my feet for longs periods of time). Getting back up can still be sore, and I have to take a moment to stretch back out and work out the "kinks".

I'm not sure what my ROM is, but last measurement was over 120 degrees flex. This satisfies my surgeon, but I find it limiting. Putting on socks for examples is a bit of chore. Walking down the stairs is still a bit of an effort too. I can do it, but need to hold on to the rail for balance and support. I used to often sit with my knees tucked, but no way I can do that anymore. Indeed, my way of doing things has changed and I do mourn the loss of my previous mobility. But having said that, day to day living is just fine, I have to adjust to a new normal and accept the changes.

As far as pain goes, it's not all gone. But the word "sore" is a better adjective. Except when I occasionally catch my foot and it forces me to bend it beyond it's comfort zone! :oyvey:I would give the pain scale a #2-3, after I've been sitting for a while. Walking itself causes even less if at all. And where it does hurt, is where it has always hurt - the outside of my knee where the thigh muscle terminates at the tendons there. If I am going to be active, I take a Meloxicam and find that helps a lot.

So in the end, I am more mobile and, in less pain, than before the surgery. I was hoping to get back to "normal", but as I said previously, it's a new and different normal I have to accept and reset my expectations.

So for those of you still in the early stages of recovery, hang in there! It feels soooooo overwhelming, but it all settles down and you can get back to your life. Patience. I wish you well! :friends:
 
So in the end, I am more mobile and, in less pain, than before the surgery. I was hoping to get back to "normal", but as I said previously, it's a new and different normal I have to accept and reset my expectations.
At 22 months I definitely have made further gains since one year out. Things like being sore with prolonged standing or sitting have continued to improve and bother me very little now.
I reckon my PKR knee is now about 90% as good as my pretty perfect unoperated knee. You may well see further improvement in the next year. I have found it helpful to continue strength exercises and to treat rehab as a marathon. I do regular glute/ quads pilates about 3-4/week and it really helps.
 

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