MUA Ruby's Tuesday--July 11th, 2017<
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PolarBear60
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Ruby, when you're sleeping like that, you're giving your body the opportunity to fully concentrate on healing your knee. That rest and sleep allows it to channel all it's activity into healing. Look at sleep as a good thing and you doing everything possible to improve your healing processes. Tell yourself you're working hard on recovery by doing it, because that's how it happens.
Eveyone else has already covered the need to no let your therapist assault you, so I won't pile on. Same thing for rubbing anything onto your incision area. Rest, ice, and elevation is good. The knee will loosen up as the swelling goes down and that PT-induced trauma fades.
Eveyone else has already covered the need to no let your therapist assault you, so I won't pile on. Same thing for rubbing anything onto your incision area. Rest, ice, and elevation is good. The knee will loosen up as the swelling goes down and that PT-induced trauma fades.
OP
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Ruby9297
senior
Pumpkln , Celle, Josephine, imjustme62, Lil Cyborg, polar bear60, - thanks for your responses and indignation on my behalf. Your comments give me strength to know that I need to be more assertive with my physical therapist (whom I will only be seeing twice more before I "graduate" to a site based PT facility). Hopefully, I won't have to start all over with letting them know My boundaries, which include not causing me pain or ripping open an incision. I've taken it pretty easy over the past couple of days, and it's been nice to relax and just do what my gut tells me makes sense. It's not that I believe in necessarily laying around all day--I need to move, but not hurt myself--or more to the point, not let someone else hurt me. Much gratitude to you all!
I'm glad we've been able to help, Ruby.
Stay strong! You don't need a PT therapist who believes in No Pain, No Gain. It's the wrong approach for your recovery. PT should never hurt. If it hurts, don't do it.
Myth busting: no pain, no gain
You'll notice that I've edited you post, above, to remove the multiple tags. We ask that you don't do that because it makes it so difficult for people reading BoneSmart on small devices, like phones. All they can see at first is a list of tags. I think everyone you tagged is following your progress anyway, so we won't miss your posts.
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Stay strong! You don't need a PT therapist who believes in No Pain, No Gain. It's the wrong approach for your recovery. PT should never hurt. If it hurts, don't do it.
Myth busting: no pain, no gain
You'll notice that I've edited you post, above, to remove the multiple tags. We ask that you don't do that because it makes it so difficult for people reading BoneSmart on small devices, like phones. All they can see at first is a list of tags. I think everyone you tagged is following your progress anyway, so we won't miss your posts.
How to tag another member; how to answer when someone tags you
jboles
graduate
I was told the same thing by PT about scar tissue underneath the scar and that I needed to massage lotion into the scar to break up that scar tissue. They ask me if I'm doing it and all my home exercises, I just say uh-huh.
Oh Ruby.....you have been hurt as I was early on. I followed my gut instinct and the Smarties on this site and told that PT that she wasn't going to hurt me again. You have to find that strength within to tell them and then decide what type of PT is good for you. If they don't agree then find another therapist or just stop going and do your heel slides etc at home. Good luck! It will e so much better in the long run!
Ruby, you don't actually need to take PT. Just using your knee in your daily living is enough to rehab it. The recovery is quicker with much less swelling and pain. You need to take total control of what you do and don't do. Using your knee the way God intends it to be used is the best way. PT doesn't need to tell you how to do that. You already know! Listen to that knee. If it hurts during or afterwards don't do it again for a few weeks. Let your knee control what is done to it!
Fire wolf
graduate
Ruby, remember that *laying around all day* isn't the same as doing nothing. You are still very early in your recovery, and that laying around is giving your body the time and opportunity it needs to heal itself.
I am/was an athlete, and can have that mentality of needing to work hard and push through, which is exactly what I did to recover from all of my other surgeries, and exactly what I did NOT do after this one. Did I have a hard time with that? Yes, at first, but I wasn't able to go with that instinct initially because of the exhaustion and pain. I didn't have the benefit of this group back then, but I just listened to my body and paid attention to what was happening. The more I rested, iced and elevated, the less things hurt, swelled, etc.
My ROM started to improve a good deal before I even went to PT, which only consisted of gentle stretching for the first couple of weeks I went, then some very easy exercises were slowly added. PT never touched my knee, especially not when measuring. On the days I didn't have PT (was going 2x a week) I rested, iced, elevated, did some walking in the house for needed things (bathroom, meals, etc.) and occasionally some stretching when I felt like it.
I was concerned about my extension, but every time I mentioned it to my PT she would smile and tell me that I would get there. No pressure. My OS never measured at all. I wanted to get back to work asap, but when OS and PA suggested extending my leave from 8 weeks to 11 weeks, I didn't argue. I was seeing results from going slow and easy, and I knew that those extra few weeks would help keep me in check from trying to do too much too soon.
Our bodies are amazing and do a fine job of healing themselves. Sometimes we really just need to get out of our own way, well at least I do anyway. Please consider being kinder to yourself and just take a break. You deserve it after all you have been through!
I am/was an athlete, and can have that mentality of needing to work hard and push through, which is exactly what I did to recover from all of my other surgeries, and exactly what I did NOT do after this one. Did I have a hard time with that? Yes, at first, but I wasn't able to go with that instinct initially because of the exhaustion and pain. I didn't have the benefit of this group back then, but I just listened to my body and paid attention to what was happening. The more I rested, iced and elevated, the less things hurt, swelled, etc.
My ROM started to improve a good deal before I even went to PT, which only consisted of gentle stretching for the first couple of weeks I went, then some very easy exercises were slowly added. PT never touched my knee, especially not when measuring. On the days I didn't have PT (was going 2x a week) I rested, iced, elevated, did some walking in the house for needed things (bathroom, meals, etc.) and occasionally some stretching when I felt like it.
I was concerned about my extension, but every time I mentioned it to my PT she would smile and tell me that I would get there. No pressure. My OS never measured at all. I wanted to get back to work asap, but when OS and PA suggested extending my leave from 8 weeks to 11 weeks, I didn't argue. I was seeing results from going slow and easy, and I knew that those extra few weeks would help keep me in check from trying to do too much too soon.
Our bodies are amazing and do a fine job of healing themselves. Sometimes we really just need to get out of our own way, well at least I do anyway. Please consider being kinder to yourself and just take a break. You deserve it after all you have been through!
Fire wolf
graduate
Oh, and I have also been told to do the whole scar massage after every surgery (yes, I have a good number of scars), and they are all fine even though I didn't do it. I would put vitamin E oil or lotion on them when they were healed, but didn't dig it in. My purpose was just to moisturize it to keep it soft and supple for my own comfort. Also, for me it helped to desensitize the scar as I was rubbing over it, but not pressing hard, on a regular basis so sheets and clothes didn't annoy them as much.
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Ruby9297
senior
Agree about scar massage. In 2003 I had a rare bone disease in my wrist: avascular necrosis of the lunate bone (or Kienbock's disease). I had half my lunate cut off, then each side was fused to the hamate and capitate, using a graft from the radius bone in my lower arm. The recovery was brutal! I went several weeks with two sets of pins sticking out of my wrist like chopsticks. The therapist told me to Massage the scar to prevent scar tissue that would negatively impact my ROM. It was too painful, so I didn't. Today, you can barely see the scars, and my ROM is as good as it could be with three wrist bones fused together.
PolarBear60
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If you do choose to do outpatient PT, think about what YOUR goals are before you go and be prepared to discuss that at the first session. They should ask. If they don't and they aren't receptive to discussing your goals with you, consider finding another clinic.
They're likely to work with you on balance. If you have any concerns, then that first meeting is the time to discuss them. It's perfectly okay to ask them what their philosophy is. One thing they should tell you somewhere in the process is, "If it hurts, tell me, and I'll find another way." Sometimes they will try an exercise you're not ready to do yet, so they need to find a more supportive way for you to do it. Also, they should be more than willing to answer any questions or explain what they are asking you to do and why you're doing it. Their job is to help you achieve YOUR goals.
Good luck.
They're likely to work with you on balance. If you have any concerns, then that first meeting is the time to discuss them. It's perfectly okay to ask them what their philosophy is. One thing they should tell you somewhere in the process is, "If it hurts, tell me, and I'll find another way." Sometimes they will try an exercise you're not ready to do yet, so they need to find a more supportive way for you to do it. Also, they should be more than willing to answer any questions or explain what they are asking you to do and why you're doing it. Their job is to help you achieve YOUR goals.
Good luck.
Josephine
NURSE DIRECTOR EMERITA
Does your gut tell you not to go back to PT at all? Ever? You really don't need it, you know.
Sure. Here it is:
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Ruby9297
senior
My gut is conflicted. Prior to finding the Bonesmart website, every person I had known who had a TKR either did super well if they " did everything the pt and doctor told them to do" or ended up having problems If they didn't do their exercises. I know one lady who had a TKR in February this year. It never healed properly and she regrets the pain and suffering, (which she still has) "all for nothing" but two weeks after surgery, she was driving her grandkids to my school, picking them up, and taking care of them after school. When I realized this, I asked how she was even able to drive. Wasn't she still on pain meds? Couldn't her grown kids find anyone else to take care of their kids until she got better?--they couldn't. So then I told her to call our front office on her cell phone when she got to school, and we would bring the kids to her so she didn't have to get out of the car. Poor thing! Her outcome has been unsatisfactory, and she advised me against doing the surgery altogether.
My 80 year-old cousin had a TKR this year; she developed a horrible infection, and had to have further surgery, expecting a revision. Fortunately, they cleaned out the infected tissue and she avoided the revision. She advised me against getting a TKR because the of the pain, especially PT was unbearable for her. I saw her four months after her surgery, and she was still in excruciating pain.
My friend's husband had a MUA and was told it was because he didn't do his exercises and PT properly. I don't want to end up getting a MUA; it sounds horrible. My PT told me that if I think I've felt bad pain so far, then I really don't want to wake up after a MUA-- it will be so much worse!
I reflected upon these examples, as well as several more I haven't shared,and then I stumbled upon Bone smart that has a completely different philosophy, but makes total sense. By nature, I am assertive, I question doctors and medical professionals, I read a lot, I research that which I feel I need to learn more about. I educate myself, and do not rely on only what I am told by a doctor. It's this very nature that led me to this site. My gut is definitely leaning towards the Bonesmart way.
My PT returned today for the first time since he essentially caused a setback last week. As politely as possible, I described the setback that I believed he caused, that he actual tore a bit of my incision when he pushed my leg back,and I showed it to him. I told him that we would not be doing anything that hurt me anymore. He was respectful and said, "tell me if you don't want to do something." So I did. When I felt pain. I said, "I've had enough. It's hurting me now, and I have to ice." He stopped, and didn't give me any attitude. It was a short session. But I also took a walk around my garden before it got too hot today, (109 degrees is a tad toasty for my liking). I made my own lunch, did a load of laundry, and cleaned the kitty litter box. I'm getting around. I can shower, dress myself, take care of all personal needs, and I'm making progress by being kind to my knee. Being kind is elevating and icing a lot, and not overdoing anything. So, good point, @Josephine, perhaps I don't need PT at all. This is a huge learning experience for me. I just wish it hadn't been so painful!
Sent from my iPad using broken link removed: https://r.tapatalk.com/byo?rid=75543
LTKR scheduled on July 11th, 2017 [emoji51]
Lil Cyborg
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Thesoutherncook
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I'm a week behind you and understand your feeling so well. Thankfully, I have good PT folks who listen. There have been several times when I've literally hollered " Uncle" ! They were not even aware that they had pushed too far! With #1, I quit PT and told them I would go back to the gym. My old knee did not want to participate.
And the world did not end! It helps me to repeat the mantra, "This is MY recovery. This is MY knee. This is MY life."
And the world did not end! It helps me to repeat the mantra, "This is MY recovery. This is MY knee. This is MY life."
Happydale
senior
I absolutely hate to hear that any PT would say to you: "if I think I've felt bad pain so far, then I really don't want to wake up after a MUA-- it will be so much worse!" I don't believe this is true, based on others' testimony on this website, but even if it were true, what a thing to say!! I wonder if you can find someone else who is more supportive, understanding, and actually helpful. To me, the massage, back adjustments, and advice from the PT have been way more important than the exercises. But I wouldn't want to give up that support all together. And it doesn't sound like you're getting the support you need with your current therapist.
SusieShoes
Former BoneSmart staff member
PT can be useful if it supports your healing, not runs counter to it. That's why I think self-directed PT is the way to approach it. You're the boss. You alone know what hurts. The PT doesn't. Being assertive about your physical therapy helps you get the best results. People who research and seek to understand their recovery are in a great position to get the most out of their PT.
You really knew a lot of people with not great results! I too know lots of people who've had TKR, including about ten family members. Most had excellent results, though, and only a few did not. My mother was a great role model. I was her caregiver after surgery. She would tell her physical therapist at home (she refused to do outpatient) that she wouldn't do exercise A or B, but she would do exercise C "because I think that one helps." She was picky, and she had an excellent recovery. When I found BoneSmart, the philosophy made total sense because I'd seen it in action. (Though Mom would say she did everything PT told her to do. That's how she remembers it.)
You really knew a lot of people with not great results! I too know lots of people who've had TKR, including about ten family members. Most had excellent results, though, and only a few did not. My mother was a great role model. I was her caregiver after surgery. She would tell her physical therapist at home (she refused to do outpatient) that she wouldn't do exercise A or B, but she would do exercise C "because I think that one helps." She was picky, and she had an excellent recovery. When I found BoneSmart, the philosophy made total sense because I'd seen it in action. (Though Mom would say she did everything PT told her to do. That's how she remembers it.)
Josephine
NURSE DIRECTOR EMERITA
@SusieShoes - I love that phrase!
I've seen many, many MUAs in my time. Some have a noise like tearing Velcro which is the adhesions giving way and are always inevitably painful to one degree or another. The alternative is that there is no effort required and no tearing sounds. in such cases there is almost always no pain after either.
One of this things I took from these cases was that if there was little or no pain after an MUA, the likelihood was that there were no adhesions, that the low ROM was almost certainly due to swelling and pain. Pain after an MUA, even a small amount, confirms that there was.
Pheebs52
big-cheese
Ruby, you've already been given the best advice, but I'd like to add just one more piece, straight from the mouth of my wonderful OS, as follows: "Sleep as much as you can. The vast majority of healing occurs during sleep!"
Personally, I wouldn't allow that PT back in my house. I had a similar situation with a home therapist during the first two weeks and I got rid of her, quickly! Fortunately, I was referred to a fabulous Outpatient PT; such a difference! They exist, but seem to be *rare birds.* If you can't find one that respects your boundaries, don't go at all.
Personally, I wouldn't allow that PT back in my house. I had a similar situation with a home therapist during the first two weeks and I got rid of her, quickly! Fortunately, I was referred to a fabulous Outpatient PT; such a difference! They exist, but seem to be *rare birds.* If you can't find one that respects your boundaries, don't go at all.
