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wrong. Can't be said often enough, IMO
MUA Is my PT rushing my recovery?
- Thread starter lablover64
- Start date
Tykey
big-cheese
That's a great post @Celle , and exactly as it should be for everyone.
I get really frustrated at how many times we have to "rescue" the "victims" from ignorant old fashioned physiotherapists.
Everybody does a superb job on here helping people to recover. But it's always after the event, it would be better if it stopped happening at all.
That's how things have developed here in the UK. Essentially, hands-on physiotherapy isn't offered, all we get is support and advice, then are expected to follow what is essentially the Bonesmart way. If we choose not to take and apply the advice (eg take to our beds), it's our own fault, and if it needs further surgical intervention we only have our self to blame.
How can we get the message out!
I wish I knew
I get really frustrated at how many times we have to "rescue" the "victims" from ignorant old fashioned physiotherapists.
Everybody does a superb job on here helping people to recover. But it's always after the event, it would be better if it stopped happening at all.
That's how things have developed here in the UK. Essentially, hands-on physiotherapy isn't offered, all we get is support and advice, then are expected to follow what is essentially the Bonesmart way. If we choose not to take and apply the advice (eg take to our beds), it's our own fault, and if it needs further surgical intervention we only have our self to blame.
How can we get the message out!
I wish I knew
Tykey, can you explain further what you mean by this? What type of further surgical procedure can we be blamed for?
Tykey
big-cheese
I maybe picked the wrong words, it would have been better to use "longer term treatment and support". Its really a general comment about how the NHS views health these days , not just hips and knees, and maybe goes some way to explain why aggressive PT procedures don't seem to appear on this side of the pond
It is so hit and miss with PT. Some are really good and explain why they're having you do things and treat you as an individual and others fall back on some cookie cutter protocol.
sectac
junior member
@lablover64
I can only tell you from experience that this forum has been a lifesaver. I also had a horrible experience with PT and they had wrenched on my knees (I had bilateral knee replacements) but I was unaware of what was right and what was wrong. I had read a few websites (unfortunately not Bonesmart) before going to PT and they had mentioned how some PT places were barbaric in the way they treated their patients with knee replacements. I was terrified going the first time to PT and yes he hurt me to the point of screaming and crying. I also experienced PT PTSD. I couldn't sleep the night before any therapy and I was on the verge of crying before even going into PT after the first time because I knew what was in store for me. My PT also told me that I had to work hard in order to prevent scar tissue from forming and only 6 week post op my OS told me I had to have a MUA because I wasn't reaching my ROM of 110 (crazy!!!). Again, I was too timid to voice my opinion on what was going on because after all they are the "specialist" and should know what they are doing.. Right?!?!? WRONG. Well, if anyone would ask me today I sing the praises of Bonesmart. I can't talk enough about this forum. And I can tell you that their advice about rest, ice and elevate as much as possible is so very true and as RockGirl14 (sorry if I'm wrong) put it just walking around doing daily living things helps so much. People at work have already commented to me that my knees look straighter and bend a lot more than they did before I came back to work. I haven't been back to my PT in well over a month and I don't plan on going back. I have an appointment with my OS at the end of October and I can't wait for her to see how much I can bend compared to when I last seen her. The best part will be when I tell her that this was all due to Bonesmart and their wonderful advice NOT the PT she referred me to. I wish you the best.
Theresa
I can only tell you from experience that this forum has been a lifesaver. I also had a horrible experience with PT and they had wrenched on my knees (I had bilateral knee replacements) but I was unaware of what was right and what was wrong. I had read a few websites (unfortunately not Bonesmart) before going to PT and they had mentioned how some PT places were barbaric in the way they treated their patients with knee replacements. I was terrified going the first time to PT and yes he hurt me to the point of screaming and crying. I also experienced PT PTSD. I couldn't sleep the night before any therapy and I was on the verge of crying before even going into PT after the first time because I knew what was in store for me. My PT also told me that I had to work hard in order to prevent scar tissue from forming and only 6 week post op my OS told me I had to have a MUA because I wasn't reaching my ROM of 110 (crazy!!!). Again, I was too timid to voice my opinion on what was going on because after all they are the "specialist" and should know what they are doing.. Right?!?!? WRONG. Well, if anyone would ask me today I sing the praises of Bonesmart. I can't talk enough about this forum. And I can tell you that their advice about rest, ice and elevate as much as possible is so very true and as RockGirl14 (sorry if I'm wrong) put it just walking around doing daily living things helps so much. People at work have already commented to me that my knees look straighter and bend a lot more than they did before I came back to work. I haven't been back to my PT in well over a month and I don't plan on going back. I have an appointment with my OS at the end of October and I can't wait for her to see how much I can bend compared to when I last seen her. The best part will be when I tell her that this was all due to Bonesmart and their wonderful advice NOT the PT she referred me to. I wish you the best.
Theresa
lablover64
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I just got a call from my surgeon's office. Seems my PT called him and told him I was not progressing quickly enough and they thought he should see me sooner than the 11/19 appointment I was originally given. So, I'm going on Monday, 11/04, the day after my birthday. I don't know what to expect. My incision is healing nicely and, if at all possible, I would like to do water therapy. I just think it will be better for me. The PT group I currently see doesn't have it, so I doubt my doctor will okay it. I have used a yoga strap at home to try bending and stretching the knee and I have to admit to not seeing much progress. What if my doc recommends manipulation under anesthesia? Should I do it?
Tykey
big-cheese
That all depends if you've taken all the advice you've been given on here. Please, can you just remind us what your ROM is at the moment, I've had a quick look back and couldn't find it.
3 weeks post op is way to early to even discuss a manipulation. You are in the very early days of recovery, you have had inappropriate aggressive PT, and you yourself are forcing the bend with a strap.
All these things are keeping your knee upset and swollen. I suggest you look into a different PT facility that will encourage you, rather than hold you to an inaccurate “cookie cutter” standard of “progress.” Your current PT is not allowing your body the privilege of sorting itself out, instead they are rushing you to their standard.
We all progress, in general, at different rates. At 3 weeks post op you only need gentle movements to keep your knee mobile.
All these things are keeping your knee upset and swollen. I suggest you look into a different PT facility that will encourage you, rather than hold you to an inaccurate “cookie cutter” standard of “progress.” Your current PT is not allowing your body the privilege of sorting itself out, instead they are rushing you to their standard.
We all progress, in general, at different rates. At 3 weeks post op you only need gentle movements to keep your knee mobile.
You can go to whoever you want to go to. It's your knee, your insurance and your healing. I suggest to go to another group that is not so aggressive and pushy. Your knee is still in the very angry stages and the swelling and pain is keeping it from bending more. This is completely normal. Do not let anyone force your knee to do anything painful. That just sets recovery back by causing extra pain and swelling.
Not at 3 weeks. This is a crazy idea. You have all those inside tissues trying to knit back together. If you have a MUA now, it'll tear them apart and cause much more inflamation, swelling and pain. Your number one goal is to heal, not to exercise. To heal you start by getting that swelling and pain down. You do that by resting, elevating, icing and gentle movements. Walking around the house is all your knee needs at this stage. Just taking care of your daily needs is exercise enough.
InkedMarie
post-grad
You can go to any therapy place that your insurance covers.
lablover64
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Had a horrible day at PT today. I cannot get comfortable in the car and I drove myself to therapy. I had been doing the exercises and thought I had some improvement. They measured my flexibility and it had decreased since last week! Again, they pushed me to have them bend my knee forcibly. I declined. Again they told me that now my knee had healed this way and I'd never be able to bend it without force. I'm finding it a challenge to be civil to them. The male of the PT team is worse than the female. She, at least, is willing to keep doing regular exercises at my own pace. He called my surgeon and they moved my appointment up to Monday. I really hope my doc is more reasonable. Has anyone had the manipulation under anesthesia? If so, did it help?
lablover64
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lablover64
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ROM was 62 last week and 57 today.
Many members have had manipulation. Some were helped with it, some were not.
Here’s a list of members with MUAs:
I will repeat, 3 weeks post op is way too early to even consider this. You most likely just need time and gentler treatment for your bend to improve.
I’m going to ask @Jamie to come and talk with you.
Here’s a list of members with MUAs:
I will repeat, 3 weeks post op is way too early to even consider this. You most likely just need time and gentler treatment for your bend to improve.
I’m going to ask @Jamie to come and talk with you.
Please go back and read all the previous replies. They come from real people who have had the same surgery you’ve had, and regained ROM, in time. Your PTs most likely have never experienced aTKR themselves, and they probably don’t see patients further down the line of recovery, so they believe in this mythical window of opportunity that is not true. My ROM continued to improve after 2 years.
That is pure baloney. They are using scare tactics to try and make you do what they say. It is obvious that they have not been trained on how to rehab a knee replacement. Don't go back to them! They are causing more harm than good.
Cancel your appointment. Your PT had no right to call your doctor and complain about your results. It is much to early to have a MUA. Stop doing your exercises and let your knee settle down. Just do gentle movements with NO forcing past discomfort.
Many of us have told you that your therapy is causing you more harm than good. We are trying to help you. We have experience to back us up. Stop letting PT bully you. YOU are paying them, whether it's through you insurance or out of your pocket, so you are the boss. They work for you. You are the only one that has to be pleased, not the PT and not your OS. You are the boss of both of them. Not the other way around. Go on youtube and look at a live TKR and see why your knee needs gentle treatment, not aggressive exercises.
If you want to have a talk with your surgeon on November 4th, then go. Seeing him a week early really no big deal. But, you definitely should stop trying to drive (most people aren't cleared to drive for 6 weeks) and stay home from therapy until you do see the surgeon. You will be fine with walking about the house every hour or so and gentle bends and stretches several times a day. Your knee requires time to settle after all it's been through with that horrid PT group.
If your surgeon recommends an MUA, tell him you'd like to give yourself a month or so to try a different (more gentle) therapy approach. Tell him you'd like to try water therapy as soon as he would approve you to be a pool.
If your surgeon recommends an MUA, tell him you'd like to give yourself a month or so to try a different (more gentle) therapy approach. Tell him you'd like to try water therapy as soon as he would approve you to be a pool.
You want to talk about aggressive PT. I had my TKR on right knee on10/9 20 days ago. I have a PT come to my home and she's been here 11 of the last 20 days. And she bends the knee as far as she can causing me excruciating pain. My ROM is at 95 and seems to have stayed there no matter what she does. I blame it on the swelling due to overworking the knee. I also do PT on my own in the afternoon they want me to do it at night too. I told them by night my knee blows up and I cant move it. So I do PT twice a day. I go see my surgeon for 30 day follow up next Tue the 5th. Last I want to hear is they need to manipulate.
Good luck
Good luck
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