TKR TRKR 10/13/23 - Moving Forward with Many Detours

[dubloosh]

After all the times BoneSmart advises not to let therapists hurt during sessions, this happened to me.

I’m so sorry this happened, and yes, they catch us by surprise, and yes it’s hard to really make our point with them. Been there, done that. You’ll know next time, don’t even let her touch you. The “massage” was not worth it. Maybe ask for a different PT, or find another office? Or, do your own rehab at home, which many of our members have done, quite successfully.

I agree that the next time you see this therapist (if you go back), you need to establish firm rules for the sessions that make it plain you will not tolerate her continuing anything when you ask her to stop. You may even want to advise the clinic manager that she continued to do things that hurt you when you requested that she stop.

Thank you @Jockette and @Jamie. She's one of the owners so I chose her; however, you're right, before she does anything I'm going to tell her what I don't want her to do. Next week I'm seeing someone else. I'd forgotten about the soft tissue that needs to heal after scar tissue removal and am afraid it will return. If the same thing happens again at PT, then I'll leave and keep walking up and down stairs instead of taking the elevator as I've been doing. I'll also search the words 'home' and 'rehab' to get ideas. Thank you again. Adding: I think heat was not a good idea though I thought it would help. When I get back I'll ice it for a while. I'm sure it will calm down.

 

[Jamie]

It will calm down once your knee has a chance to recover. You might also take an NSAID if you can take them. It helps with inflammation and pain. You’re right that heat isn’t usually as good as ice for inflammation.

 

[Jockette]

It might even be a little early to do extra stairs. Just walking can do wonders as we’re healing, but not to excess.

Soft tissue can take a really long time to heal. I fell and landed on my PKR leg at 6 years post op. No damage to the implant, but lots of damage to the soft tissue. I had lots of swelling and bruising. It took 2 months to get better. I realize that’s an extreme example, I fell hard, on a hard wood floor. But any upset to the soft tissue after a surgery can take time to heal, but just because it’s slow, doesn’t mean it’s not happening. And, trying to do more, to hurry it up, can backfire. Slow and steady is usually the way to go.

 

[Layla]

The therapist came over to do myofascial release with cream; however, she asked me to bend my knee and held my foot for 30 seconds. I told her it hurt and to stop; she said it's good for my ROM. I'm too polite to curse, but WHAT was she doing? I finally got my foot free and told her not to do that again, at which point she rubbed my knee really hard, and again I told her it hurt.

I am sorry you had to experience this. It sounds like a very uncomfortable situation and I'm sure it was distressing. It's unfortunate that you're even put into a situation where you have to say, NO, or STOP. You have every right to set up boundaries and she should respect them. I do hope your Thursday session is much easier and if she ever pushes you again, consider seeking a better match in a therapist. There are good ones out there, but sometimes it takes trial and error...unfortunately. Feel better soon, dubloosh! Hugs

 

[dubloosh]

It will calm down once your knee has a chance to recover. You might also take an NSAID if you can take them. It helps with inflammation and pain. You’re right that heat isn’t usually as good as ice for inflammation.

Thank you @Jamie. I was out doing errands and conscious of my knee and put ice on it when I came home. The heat in the car felt good; heating pad is different. Tomorrow is my pamper knee day.

 

[dubloosh]

It might even be a little early to do extra stairs. Just walking can do wonders as we’re healing, but not to excess.
But any upset to the soft tissue after a surgery can take time to heal, but just because it’s slow, doesn’t mean it’s not happening. And, trying to do more, to hurry it up, can backfire. Slow and steady is usually the way to go.

I'm sorry that you were hurt @Jockette and appreciate you sharing. Thank you for the reminder that knees take time to heal. Back to the elevator.

 

[dubloosh]

I am sorry you had to experience this. It sounds like a very uncomfortable situation and I'm sure it was distressing. It's unfortunate that you're even put into a situation where you have to say, NO, or STOP. You have every right to set up boundaries and she should respect them. I do hope your Thursday session is much easier and if she ever pushes you again, consider seeking a better match in a therapist. There are good ones out there, but sometimes it takes trial and error...unfortunately. Feel better soon, dubloosh! Hugs

Thank you @Layla and hugs back. She's one of the owners; today I learned she has a heavy hand, like she was kneading dough. I did say no a few times. Reason I went back to PT is because I don't have a stationary bicycle at home. Maybe it would be a good idea to join a gym just to do that; Medicare may cover it. From what I read here, it seems others had therapists who overdid it. I'll switch if it happens again.

 

[mendogal]

Traditional Medicare doesn't cover a gym. However, my "MediGap" supplemental covers basic gym membership at my local Anytime Fitness and I believe many "Advantage" plans do cover gyms.

 

[dubloosh]

That's good to know @mendogal, and thank yo.u. I have neither and may have to get another plan.

 

[dubloosh]

Hi! I'm not happy right now. My op knee is very painful, and I have pain walking up stairs, this since the therapist bent my knee Tuesday. I made an appointment with my surgeon for tomorrow morning to ask him about it; I think it may be where the IT band meets my knee. I'm so angry the therapist keeps saying it's coming from my back. I can't seem to find a good PT place so may have to leave and keep walking and doing my own PT. There was a numb area on the lateral side of my knee where the incision was made, and it was only numb, never hurt. This is painful. I hope she didn't do damage to my knee, which is why I made the appointment for tomorrow. He feels my knee and checks how I walk. Maybe it's safe to get a cortisone injection there, too, while it heals. I'm sorry about my tone and am very worried. It's been cold for the past two weeks, and my knee was never numb.

 

[Jockette]

this since the therapist bent my knee Tuesday.

Unfortunately, these injuries can take a while to recover. It looks like it’s going to take more than a few days for this one. I hope your appointment goes well and your surgeon is able to calm your concerns.

Hang in there and vent here all you want! I’ve been hurt by a PT, also, so I understand.

 

[dubloosh]

Thank you @Jockette. I'm sorry you were hurt, too, in PT. I thought the goal was to help healing. I'm sure it's soft tissue yet now I'm unable to tell the difference between that and healing from the scar tissue removal procedure. Oy.

 

[mendogal]

I agree it's likely not any real damage, just aggravated soft tissue, which includes healing from the arthroscopic procedure.

 

[dubloosh]

Thank you @mendogal, that's reassuring. Just got home from the eye doctor and walked downstairs two flights to get the mail. Still able to do that plus a tiny pinch at the top of my kneecap. I plan to rest my knee and ice it and stop PT. No pain when I sit; I feel it when I stand. A mini-setback of sorts.

 

[Layla]

I am sorry your knee is so painful. I do hope with more rest / ice and another good nights sleep it feels even better tomorrow. Best wishes for some reassurance at your appointment also. Please let us know how it goes.
@dubloosh

 

[dubloosh]

Thank you @Layla, and I shall. I put castor oil on my knee and wrapped it with plastic. Dr. Oh will tell me to stop PT. Editing: stop means stop, and no means no. I was going to file a complaint yet won't do anything until I speak with hm.

 

[dubloosh]

HI hi! Back from my surgeon's visit and a stop at the library. He ordered xrays, which he said were normal. I've lost muscle from my op leg - it looked thinner than my other leg - yet nothing happened to the implant. He asked why I went to physical therapy (not blaming me; however, we've had this discussion before), and I said I'm afraid scar tissue will form in the areas where it was removed. He said the procedure November 12 was successful (he told me that at an earlier time) and that he removed a lot of scar tissue from the top and middle of my kneecap (from the original surgery) via two tiny incisions at the bottom of my kneecap. I’m repeating myself (sorry) because I need reminders, and because Dr. Google says scar tissue will reform. Two weeks post op (October 2023) I developed an infection at the top of my incision and didn't go to outpatient PT until it healed; this gave my body plenty of time to form scar tissue. That’s why I had pain at the top of my knee and was unable to walk down steps foot over foot. The surgery plus the infection made my body protective, sort of. Scar tissue removed when the original incision is fully healed doesn't form again. Thank you for your encouragement and support.

You are right; I have a soft tissue injury from someone kneading my knee like a ball of dough (he laughed at that though I know him a long time and know he wasn’t making fun of me). Continue massaging with either castor oil or whatever works, take NSAIDs when needed, and no PT. He said it takes a few months, about four in general, to heal from scar tissue removal, longer if it's done soon after surgery (to increase bending ability). I can still walk down stairs foot over foot, just not four flights at one time. Going to be more gentle with my knee now.

 

[Jamie]

Your surgeon is right on target about needing to allow your knee to settle after surgery. Please erase Dr. Google from your recovery tool bag and rely on your surgeon’s excellent advice.

 

[dubloosh]

Hi @Jamie, you're right. This weekend will have to be dedicated to knee care as I'm starting a new job Tuesday - forgot to share good news in the knee episode - and I'll have to walk steps between the first and second floors. I was going to ask my surgeon for an MRI; the pain is mostly on either side of my kneecap.. The new job is three days per week at a local funeral home assisting the director of preplanning and aftercare, and I'm excited to find work after several months of looking. Should I bother with the MRI?

Adding: might you recommend a knee brace? Today I applied castor oil to my knee and covered it with plastic wrap, then taped the end so it wouldn't unravel. It makes a slight sound as I walk so would not be appropriate to wear this at work. Last year the at-home therapist told me to measure four inches above my knee - it's 16-1/2" - and buy a brace within that margin. The support feels very good; I'd wear it during the day and use the castor oil wrap at night. Thank you.

 

[Jamie]

A brace may help you while at work. You could try it and see. Your surgeon would be the one to know whether or not you need an MRI. I would be surprised if he thinks this is necessary. Just do be careful on the stairs. You really want to take things easy at least for the first few weeks back at work. If that means taking one step at a time, then it would be best to keep that up for a while. Pushing to walk foot over foot will only cause your knee to become inflamed. That is not what your surgeon has recommended. So, I’d stay away from trying that on the stairs for a while. Remember, this is only temporary if you do it right.