TKR Three years with new knee and new questions

Thanks Pumpkin and Skigirl. Pumpkin, the truth is that I don't quite know what I have. One doc says it's likely allergy, but not definitively; the second hasn't seen me yet, but doesn't think allergies are likely just because of a patch or blood test. He seems to think that there's likely a huge difference between quad strength in the TKR knee and the other. That's why I have swelling and pain. Orthodoc says maybe I should rule out an impingement. I want to do something. I can certainly have images sent to U of Penn. or Jefferson in Phila. My best friend's son is a resident at U of Penn. He could certainly give me an idea about who to see. I actual feel a bit more hopeful. I know he didn't mean to come off this way, but the first doc, who said, "sleep on it, I'll see you in a year," left me feeling that he mean, "Revisions are typically awful. I think you should just suck it up." I may go and see the surgeon who did the operation so he can check the quad strength. Or just get to my PT and have her see. Hope is a huge thing.
 
Juniper, I'm very concerned that this is focussing on allergies which are extremely rare and impingements which are even more so. I'd like to ask, are you still exercising? If so, may I to ask you these questions? It would be very helpful if you would answer each one individually - numbered as I have done - in as much detail as you can then I'll come back as see where you are ....

1. what are your pain levels right now? (remember the 1-10 scale: 1 = no pain and 10 = the worst you can imagine. And don't compare this with the bone-on-bone pain you had before surgery!
[Bonesmart.org] Three years with new knee and new questions
)
Also don't forget to include other forms of pain such as soreness, burning, stabbing, throbbing, aching, swelling and stiffness

2. what pain medications have you been prescribed, how much are you taking (in mg please) and how often?

3. are you still icing your knee and for how long?

4. are you still elevating your leg, how often and for how long?

5. What is your ROM - that's flexion (bend) and extension (straightness)

6. what is your activity level? What do you do in the way of housework, cooking, cleaning, shopping, etc., and

7. what kind of PT exercises and exercises at home are you doing? How much and how often? (and detailed details would be appreciated, please! **Reps, sets and sessions** and all that)

** If you're not familiar with this, it goes like so:
1 lift of your leg = 1 rep (repetition)
5 reps and then a brief rest = 1 set
5 sets and finishing = 1 session.
 
Josephine, I'll try to answer you questions, maybe a few today and the rest tomorrow. I can't believe you are on the site and asking me about what is happening. I love you.



The surgeon who replaced my knee got back to me the day after I wrote asking his P.A. to call me. That was really nice, I mean it. He told me he didn't think allergic reaction was the likely reason I had pain and fluid in my knee. Thought it might be what you're suggesting, quad weakness. I do weight lifting with my legs and hip exercises about three times a week. Every day I walk or spend a half hour on the elliptical. Working hard enough to sweat. Swim a half hour twice a week. The issue is that I am still teaching and sometimes have to stand for a while...then I limp out of school, even though I usually work only three to four hours a day. So--standing is what gets me.

Answers to you questions:



1. My pain during the day is maybe two or three at the beginning of the day. That's where it is right now. I can't walk downstairs without that kind of pain. By the end of a work day, it's up to five or six. The truth is that I am learning to ignore pain I wouldn't have ignored before the TKR. I could walk easily before it. Now, I am always aware of stiffness, and if I stand for twenty minutes, I feel the pain, aching swelling, hard as a rock in my knee pain, mounting to five or six. Sometimes I am not registering pain consciously, but a colleague or parent will ask if I'm in pain because they can see that I'm limping.

2. I take no pain meds, except in order to sleep...alternate 10 mg. of melatonin (first night), 50 mg of benadryl (second night), and Tylenol PM: 1000mg acetaminophen with 50 mg of benadryl (third night). I wake because of knee pain, so when I try to do without, I don't sleep well, and wake about 3:00 or 4:00.

3 and 4. I hadn't been icing my knee at all. But now in the past month, I ice and elevate for a half hour after teaching or any other time I've been standing and the knee begins to get stiff and achy.

4. Most days, I elevate my knee when I get home from work or from shopping.

5. My leg can get completely straight. Flexion is 120 easily, can be pushed a bit further. The PT I worked with two summers ago, helped me get my knee bent not only lying on my back, but also on my stomach...there was a huge difference between those two numbers.

6. activity level is moderate. I do all shopping, half the cleaning, walk for a half hour daily, spend a half hour at the gym daily, using the elliptical or bike and on weekends add swimming so I'm there for an hour. Work for three to five hours on most school days. I can sit at times, but generally am on my feet. Go up and down stairs about twenty times a day.

7. I do leg exercises every other day.
straight leg lifts with five pound weight 20 reps rest, twenty reps, rest, 10 reps (I do this for each leg, both quads are weak).

Hips are also weak. Do leg lifts on my side, 20 reps (without weight), rest, twenty reps. Alternate that with walking sideways for 100 steps, with a band around my ankles.

bend knee and hold for 10 seconds, 10 reps.

lie on my stomach and pull leg towards back with a band. 10 second hold, 10 reps.

Josephine, you are the best for asking about this. Merry Christmas.
[Bonesmart.org] Three years with new knee and new questions
 
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1. My pain during the day is maybe two or three at the beginning of the day. That's where it is right now. I can't walk downstairs without that kind of pain. By the end of a work day, it's up to five or six.
Okay ...
2. I take no pain meds, except in order to sleep...alternate 10 mg. of melatonin (first night), 50 mg of benadryl (second night), and Tylenol PM: 1000mg acetaminophen with 50 mg of benadryl (third night). I wake because of knee pain, so when I try to do without, I don't sleep well, and wake about 3:00 or 4:00.
That's not a good idea to ignore pain. If you don't treat it, you risk developing chronic pain
3 and 4. I hadn't been icing my knee at all. But now in the past month, I ice and elevate for a half hour after teaching or any other time I've been standing and the knee begins to get stiff and achy.
You accomplish little or nothing in 30 minutes. Ice more.
5. My leg can get completely straight. Flexion is 120 easily, can be pushed a bit further.
That's good.

Your exercises - my comments in bold
I do leg exercises every other day - why? Your ROM is good - why do you still need to do exercises
straight leg lifts with 5lb 20 reps rest, 20 reps, rest, 10 reps (I do this for each leg, both quads are weak) - wow! this is punitive!
Hips are also weak. Do leg lifts on my side, 20 reps (without weight), rest, 20 reps - ditto
Alternate that with walking sideways for 100 steps with a band around my ankles - ditto
Bend knee and hold for 10 seconds, 10 reps - to what end? your ROM is good
Lie on my stomach and pull leg towards back with a band 10 second hold 10 reps - ditto!

Without any shadow of a doubt, I'd say that your exercises are the direct cause of your pain. Everything you've described here contributes in no small way to this. You keep saying your hips and quads are weak. This might be the way to do strength and fitness training when you're fit and well but your knee has had major surgery and so things aren't normal. My assumption is that you've been doing these kinds of exercises all along - would I be right? And the consequence of this is obvious. Read this to see serious examples of what I am saying PT: the seriously grave consequences of doing too much of it.
 
Okay, Josephine. I see that you think I am doing way too much in terms of exercise, and not icing/elevating long enough to help. I am going to set aside exercises for now. Do you think swimming, elliptical, walking are reasonable? After three years I thought I could get back to doing what I want to do. A year and a half ago, I returned to PT with a woman who was very gentle, but did think my quads and hips were weak. She's the one who had me doing the lifts and bends. That summer, my knee improved dramatically. It was the best it's been since the TKR. The truth is, she wondered how it would be when I returned to teaching and was on my feet for any length of time. And she was right. It hurt more.

I am going to try what you say. I think you feel I should cut out exercises completely? Am I right? And just walk, swim, maybe a bit of elliptical? Is that right? If I do take pain meds, should I take before I go in to school to teach? Or when the pain comes on? I just thought that after three years, I'd be able to do my life now--teach, walk, swim. I hear that you think I'm being unrealistic, and perhaps also that I need to listen to my body more. Am I right? Is this what you're saying?

Thank you for responding so thoroughly and good luck with your upcoming TKR.
 
I think you feel I should cut out exercises completely? Am I right? And just walk, swim, maybe a bit of elliptical? Is that right?
Just walk and swim.
If I do take pain meds, should I take before I go in to school to teach? Or when the pain comes on?
If it were me, I'd just take them regularly and not because of any forthcoming activity. That way, you shouldn't have to experiencing the pain coming on.
I just thought that after three years, I'd be able to do my life now
Yes, and so you should. But as you read in the article I left you, the biggest problem there was that the people mentioned didn't stop doing the exercises which placed unusual and extreme stresses and strains on muscles. If they had just stopped at 3, 4 or 5 months out and let normal activity be their therapy, all would have been well. But they didn't and you saw what the consequences were for them. Not that I am predicting such a serious fate for you but you could end up with a long term soreness if you don't let it rest and recover. That's all I am cautioning you about.
 
Josephine, good luck tomorrow. I'm still not sure what to do. Too much PT clearly was a problem and set back my recovery. I don't know that strengthening my quads is a bad idea, given that they aren't strong at all. I now have four different opinions about what is going on with me, and what I should do. Nothing. PT. have my knee scoped and rest, ice and medicate. Skigirl, I think about how much exercise you did as you recovered and how you can now ski. I don't need to ski, but I'd like to be able to stand for three or four hours so I could teach. What do you think?
 

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