Revision TKR August 1st 2023 Second TKR Revision Left Knee

WFD

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Long time lurker here, this is my first post.

I had two arthroscopic meniscectomies on my left knee to deal with a torn meniscus, in 1998 and 2009. Recovery went well and I resumed all my sports and activities, though running and hiking had to go.

By October 2020 I was bone on bone, in pain, and my RoM was down to maybe 70°, so I had a full knee replacement. During rehab, RoM peaked at 95° warm and then rapidly went downhill as my knee filled with scar tissue. At five months I had 70° cold and 85° warm RoM.

In March 2021 I had an open arthrolysis to clean out the scar tissue. Initially things seemed better and I reached 105° warm before the scar tissue took over and I ended up back at 70°/85°.

In July of 2021 I went to a revision specialist in Boston and he performed a complete revision, removing all the scar tissue and putting in a new knee with a smaller spacer to give the knee more room to deal with scar tissue. The original femoral implant, which had been press-fit, wasn't loose per se but came right out without any force used. The new knee is cemented in place.

After the previous two surgeries I had pretty standard aggressive PT but after this one I found a new therapist that would work with me and backed way off on the level of force, sticking with mostly gentle stretches and motion-based activities such as using an exercise bike.

This time I peaked at 117° warm and things were looking up, but then the scar tissue came back with a vengeance, and I am once again at 75° cold and 88° warm. The difference this time is that at 3+ months, in addition to limited range of motion I still have a quite a bit of pain and it does not seem to be going away. After the other two surgeries I could at least be on my feet for a while and do things. Now I cannot be on my feet for more than about 15 minutes without having to rest my knee.

Luckily, I never had a problem with extension and can straighten my leg fully.

I am 61, in excellent health, and very fit. This limited range of motion makes it difficult to use stairs, a bicycle, or even walk without catching my foot on something. The scar tissue limits my range of motion enough even while walking that I can feel the stress in my lower back. Not being able to be on my feet for more than 15 minutes without an hour's rest keeps me from doing much that is useful or even pulling my weight around the household. A solid year of surgeries and rehab is really getting old.

I doubt that another open surgery would help me - I would just end up where I am already. About the only thing I can conceive of that would help is an arthroscopic debridement/mua with radiation pre-treatment to reduce the chances of the scar tissue coming back. There is very little in the way of research on the use of radiation, and what has been done is of low quality - no control groups and no blinding.

Does anyone have any experience with these kinds of approaches?

Can anyone recommend a surgeon in the Boston area I could consult with and that might do it?

Thanks.
 
@WFD
:welome: to BoneSmart!
Sounds like your arthrofibrosis has come back. Some surgeons do an open surgery and some do arthroscopic surgery to address arthrofibrosis.
Here is a list of surgeons who have experience with arthrofibrosis.
Arthrofibrosis: Names of US surgeons with experience in arthrofibrosis

Sorry you have been through so much with your knee in a short period of time.
Glad you had a gentle PT, a slow approach, letting your knee heal before can help reduce the incident of arthrofibrosis.

Please post your surgery dates and which surgery, a moderator will add them to your signature for you. Having the exact dates will help us properly advise you. Thanks!
 
@WFD .... I'm so sorry you've had this experience with your knee. As you're finding out, arthrofibrosis can be very difficult to successfully treat in some patients. The patients we see who have the best results are the ones who treat the knee VERY gently for many months after surgery, like your latest therapist did. Even the slightest inflammation in some people can ignite that scar-producing mechanism.

You definitely are in need of an arthrofibrosis specialist. My recommendation is to work from that list that Pumpkin provided for you. I would start with these surgeons:

* Dr. David Mayman - HHS, New York City
* Dr. Henry Finn - Weiss Memorial Hospital, Chicago
* Dr. Frank Noyes - Cincinnati, Ohio

If you are 3 months out of surgery, it is possible that you could still gain some ROM with time and gentle exercise such as cycling. Your knee has been through a lot and it can take a long time for recovery for many patients.

Please keep us updated on your progress and communications with specialists. We're here to support you in every way we can.
 
@Jamie Do you have a surgeon recommendation for Denver, CO? Oh..I guess I can go look at pumpkins post.

@WFD You have been through the wringer. I must say I admire your strength in coming this far. I wish I had words of wisdom, but alas I do not. I am just 6 weeks past my first TKR and have been told I have arthrofibrosis. I didn't know there was an approach where radiation could prevent more scarring. I believe I will be right back with my 70 degrees, no matter what they do and the radiation sounds interesting...so I will lurk to see where this discussion goes and provide support where I can!
 
@ValleyGirl .... as you can see from the list there are no specialists that I know of in Denver. The Steadman Clinic in Vail is close to you, but it is my understanding they don't accept knee patients unless they did the original TKR. Policies change, though, and you might call and check. They are an excellent clinic for arthrofibrosis.

Sadly, this is an under-served community and you would likely need to travel to see one of the surgeons on the list. Many doctors do telehealth these days, though, and it could be possible to have one or more consultations online before you'd actually have to go to the clinic.
 
@Jamie I did find one Steadman Hawkins doc that specializes in arthrofibrosis and while in Vail it looks like he serves Denver and the Springs. It is sad to hear he would not see me if he didn't do the TKR. I will call and find out...will let you know.
 
@WFD I found an article about Dr. Henry Finn at Weiss Memorial in Chicago using the radiation technique.

'In April 2017, Dr. Finn got Hicks walking tall again with a procedure in which he pioneered for this problem. It involves a 2-step process. First, a treatment involving low-dose radiation exposure to the affected knee prior to surgery. “The radiation essentially prepares the body for another procedure by turning off the scar- and bone-forming cells that come with surgical trauma,” Dr. Finn explains.'
 
Thanks, @ValleyGirl. Do you have a link to the article?

Usually, Dr. Finn is revising the knee with a rotating hinge knee, and the best I can tell, there is no going back from it, due to the amount of bone removed to fit the knee.
 
Thanks, @ValleyGirl. Do you have a link to the article?

Usually, Dr. Finn is revising the knee with a rotating hinge knee, and the best I can tell, there is no going back from it, due to the amount of bone removed to fit the knee.
Yes, it looks like he expects to do the knee change when he does the radiation...from different things I have read (look at his reviews). But certainly every case of arthrofibrosis doesn't mean the knee replacement is bad...or that a replacement was even done, right?

I submitted a request for a zoom appt with him. Hoping to get his opinion on my knee. Will let you know if they schedule me. I am also going to ask him if anyone in Denver is using the radiation technique.

Does an MRI confirm arthrofibrosis? Do you know?
 
@ValleyGirl, I have not had an MRI, but after the second (open arthrolysis to remove scar tissue) and the third (total knee revision) operations, both surgeons said my knee had as much scar tissue as they'd ever seen, so it is a safe bet that is the situation now as well. There is so much I can feel its shape and rigidity when I apply any force to it at the end of the range of motion.

Are you planning on a rotating hinge knee or considering other alternatives?

After you talk with Dr. Finn it would be super helpful if you updated us with how it went. Thanks!

I'm also curious how people who have traveled to see specialists deal with the insurance? Do they get their insurance company to pay in-network rates or do they have to pay higher out-of-network rates?
 
After you talk with Dr. Finn it would be super helpful if you updated us with how it went.
Totally agree! Very helpful as a resource for our members.

I'm not familiar with US insurance anymore but I'll tag @Jamie who might be able to give you input.
 
@WFD As far as your insurance question goes, it depends on the kind of insurance one has. With policies through Blue Cross Blue Shield or other wide range insurance, going out of the area for a consult and/or surgery probably would not be a problem. Medicare (if that is the only insurance one has) might also be OK. But if one has an HMO insurance (ie Kaiser) or a state based policy then yes there could be problems. Any one looking for an out of area provider/surgeon should check with their insurance carrier before making an appointment. For some policies a referral might be needed or some other kind of authorization.
 
@WFD I am not getting a new knee. My knee is great...it is the scar tissue I want removed. My ROM is stuck because of scar tissue.

I will definitely share any info I get from Dr. Finn or his office!
 
Yes, I merged the two lists early last year. Probably needs an update. Thanks for the reminder.
 
@ValleyGirl , I am in exactly the same situation. Can’t wait to hear what you learn. Thanks!
Have you looked at arthrofibrosis.com?

I have. I think I have found and gone through every website that deals with knees and arthrofibrosis. No one has the active forum that bonesmart does.

One of the surgeons they list, Thomas Gill, is listed by them as having experience with arthrofibrosis and has published at least one paper on arthroscopic treatment of the arthrofibrotic knee, see https://drmillett.com/wp-content/uploads/articles/Arthroscopic Tx of the Arthrofibrotic knee.pdf

It so happens that he is chair of orthopedics at the hospital I am currently being treated at, and so is in-network for me. He is the first person in this area I will be talking to. I have a check-in with the surgeon that did my revision on the 10th and will be talking with him about seeing Dr. Gill. In the past he (my surgeon) has not been enthusiastic about the prospects for an arthroscopic intervention so I may have to take this forward myself.
 
I‘m sorry you've been through so much with this knee.

In July of 2021 I went to a revision specialist in Boston and he performed a complete revision,
Could you give us the exact dates of the following procedures please, so we can complete a signature for you.

Left Revision July 2021
Open arthrolysis clean out March 2021
Left TKR October 2020

Having your history in a signature is very helpful to our staff. Thanks!
 

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